The Russians would kill all the al-Qaeda people being held captive in response to this crap...you can't bow to terrorists.

Actually, it would be interesting to release them with tracking devices, then we could bomb the crap out of 'em.

Why is it always 'rivers of blood'? Why not a lava flow?

wheres this secret web site they keeping talking about...thats what i want to see....we should kill every fuckin hostage...why not change the rules...lets be the bad guys for once...they think we will set all there mumbling blurry balled buddies out because they have 1 of our guys.

As the election draws closer, expect to see this kind of psi-ops bullshit get deeper. Everyone is a terrorist.

FUCK... We are the BAD GUYS!

Psy ops? Put your tinfoil hat on and take a step back for a sec mineralGod; it's not one big conspiracy...too many endpoints to manage effectively. It's more like a confluence of like individuals' motivations. People in our gov't are going after their goals...and from what I know about gov't, the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. That's a systemic thing. If they had control over all of it, do you think we would have heard of AbuGraib? Holy shit, man.

Dumbskull, we're doing bad things, but I have to believe we're not the bad guys...not yet. Even though we are fucking up and acting on our own self interest, I've spoken to too many soldiers who were in Iraq who were 'approached daily' by people who asked 'who will care for us when you leave?'. Even with all this crap that's in the media. I actually trust the media less than the government. (Not that that is saying much.)

No negotiations with terrorists. If they think we're terrorists, why don't they just kill our guy? It's a lot cleaner.

No...instead, they want to inflict psychological scarring (hence what makes a terrorist) over the entire planet. 'Don't fuck with us or we'll cut your head off'. The US isn't holding their guys and decapitating them one at a time for the world to see.

Interestingly enough, what does fall closer to this category of 'I'mma whoop your ass' politics is Bush's threats to Saddam a couple years back. Interesting, even if when we did it we were supposedly citing international law.

kill all the terrorists that we have and send them the heads

Tinfoil hat, funny typical response. Every now and again I see someone type that and laugh. Come on, all this shit is documented, as in Government Documents as in reported, I'm not making any of this shit up, I'm just relaying the information, and I relay these links to you people because I think that this group on the whole is smart enough to maybe look into things a little bit more.
Take the Nick Berg case for instance, this guy has the totlal M.O. of CIA. Ive league, top of his class, then all of a sudden drops out to 'travel abroad' give me a fucking break. On top of that there all all these inconsistencies witht he video. And now this shit, some website and some group. Government spooks are were I'll cast my vote before actual 'Terrorists'.
This whole right hand doesn't know what the left is doing is just total DENILE. Of course they know what the hell is up. Stop trying to deny and ask yourself / keep in mind these points:

• Its documented that our government trained and funded Al-Qiada
• Our government was responsible for 911. On that day NORAD was ordered to stand down. NORAD never stands down!
• The Matrix of control and Big Brother grows and tightens everyday while people argue over petty arguments (ie, bi-partisanship) and have the majority of brain activity distracted on bullshit
• 80% of all media is owned by the same people, do you really believe that the media tells you the truth????
• Most of our fleet is out to sea as well as that of other countries, something is going down, the FBI has TOLD you that this is going to be the summer of Terror, which can be translated to: "We're gonna blow some more shit up, evicerate your rights, and invade more countries.
• WAKE UP, do some research, stop being in denile / apathy, and do some critical thinking.

Timing is everything. All of these big news stories play out like a movie. Just like when Clinton was in the process of being impeached, oop suddenly some shits going down in the persian gulf.......? Smoke and Mirrors, Ministry of Information whatever you wanna call it. So stop rationalizing with the "Tinfoil Hat" and do a little research, the shit is getting thick and its going to hit the fan, and most of all it will hit your front door. fuck it.

They have been saying that river of blood bullshit for many years. They have managed to hit us a few times (USS Cole, Marine barracks in Beirut, that thing in NY, etc.), so why does everyone act all surprised and outraged? Personally I am angry at our government for not getting us out of that shit long ago. We should also stop buying their fucking oil. Fuck em all.

Most of the shit you just said is true, mG, but as for training al-Qaida, I have serious doubts. I'd like to see some references there. It IS documented that the CIA trained bin Laden and a certain group of resistance fighters to work against the Soviets in Afghanistan, but it's far more likely that bin Laden took the left over funds and created his own group. It's not like he even needed our money, since the bin Laden family is one of the richest families in Saudi Arabia.

I'm growing more and more convinced that the US played a part in 9/11, and that Nick Berg wasn't just some guy who decided to show up in Iraq. However, it's hard to believe that a government capable of secretly carrying out 9/11 could be the same government that's blundering in Iraq right now.

Oh and I agree with eharmony, the Russians would've just killed all the hostages. One time, a Russian airliner was hijacked by Chechens, and when they figured out who did it, they just strolled in and slaughtered everybody they found.

Its very well known that US forces go in and train indigenous forces, and the CIA did give Afhgani 'freedom fighters' Stinger Missiles, which gave them quite the edge against Russian aircraft.

hows many hours left now

anyone want pizza? my treat

If they release a gory video you buy teh pizza, i'll buy teh beer and we can party like its 1999.

mG, I know enough about our gov't that they've done some nasty stuff to our own people...like experimentation. (Most of that is constrained to the military personnel, but hey.) Gulf War Syndrome is real; I know someone who died who had it...or something from Kuwait...had this grey shit growing in his lungs which the docs never quite figured out. As for being in denial, I try to take a step back and not be paranoid first. Some of it conspiracy? Yeah. Not everything. An Afghani friend of mine told me Pakistan admitted to creating the Taliban. Osama is by birth a prince, and definitely didn't need US help to start his war. I don't think 9/11 was engineered by the US, but I think the tower collapse was purposely engineered...mostly for safety reasons, but that'd still make one sticky PR situation, eh? As for Berg, yeah...some really wierd things there. Typical spook stuff. Maybe they thought he was a double agent, so he was handed over intentionally. Ships take a long time to go places; that's why they're out of port. It gives us a tactical communications/deployment advantage. I didn't see the studies which laid out who contributed what to Al Qaeda, but there were a lot of fooled people and front groups, too.

Thinking you can stick to one political party or the other isn't using your brain...keeps the animals arguing, though. That's true. Mr. Orwell had his head on straight.

'I don't think 9/11 was engineered by the US, but I think the tower collapse was purposely engineered...mostly for safety reasons, but that'd still make one sticky PR situation, eh?...' I don't get what your're saying here. From what I hear 93% of our Navy is out to sea, which is being described as unprecedented.
Anyway a 9/11 rundown again...

• 3 floors of Tower 7 was fortified with 2-3 million dollars turning it into a bomb shelter
• The second plane had pod missile attached and was not the same plane???
• Larry Silverstein said it himself that they 'pulled' Tower 7
• WTC was shutdown for a period of 48 - 72 hours 2 weeks prior to 9/11 as docuemented by network techs.
• Radio transcripts show that the firemen had the fire under control.

I'll leave it at that. I'm not saying drop everything and march to Washington with a hatchet, most of you like me have to work jobs and pay bills. But everyone should be aware and keep there eyes and ears open and be aware and just ask yourself the question I've heard over and over: Who Stands To Gain?
SHabaZ!

could be that the government heard there were going to be an attack. just like we hear everyday. and put these bombs in the tower for safety. not knowing if it would really happen or not. I mean when those towers collapsed I was surprised to see they didn't fall to the side but instead fell inwards which is how they demolish towers anyway.

What I was saying was the attack was from outside elements, but the tower was purposely 'pulled' as you say. There were still people inside. What do you say to the families who lost loved ones? Tell them 'well, we think more people would have been hurt if we didn't do it this way'. Nobody wants to hand that explanation to the public because they'd get sued. Politically, it would be suicidal. 3 floors out of how many? Which 3? I don't know what a pod missle is, so I guess I'm at a loss...if you could furnish the link where you're getting that info I'd appreciate it. As for the 93%, we are (unofficially) at war...and we're also watching other parts of the world which may capitalize on us having such a large force in Iraq. I'd bet we're spending a lot of time around Korea and China about now. As far as who has what to gain, I don't trust Bush any more than you do...Kerry, either....they're both Skull & Bones. (Who do we get to elect again?)

Here's an interesting site:

http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/freedom.cfm?fuseaction=issues

Yeah, there's some goofy sounding shit lurking there, but the links at the bottom of that page got my attention. Especially parts 1-4. It seems to be documented but I only checked a couple of the cited sources. I'm kinda fucking lazy.

The premise is that apparently the Lusitania sinking that started ww1 and Pearl Harbor were both staged by deliberately aggravating the enemies into attacking those targets so the public, which was opposed to entering either war, would support war. Then the paper asks if these events were set up, why not 9/11? The purpose for starting wars is obviously to beat the world in to submission.

Anyway, even if it isn't true, it was an eye-opening read for me. Nothing else ever convinced me that something like 9/11 may have been knowingly allowed by the government, or whoever it is that runs everything. Normally I am very skeptical of conspiracy theories. Maybe I just got hoowinked this time, but probably not.

Dude...I told you I agreed it was demolished?

I just thought is was appropriate to post.

I'm checking out this freedomforceinternational site...it's pretty good. (Ok mG, I was unsure. My bad.)