freakbass
SENATOR BABYHEAD  Posts: 128 Registered: 2/12/2006 Offline
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7/13/2006 at 20:31 |
Does anyone get the feeling that if North Korea gets attacked, (unlikely it seems) that WWWIII might very well have begun? The US and Japan are for a possible attack.. Russia and China have sided against it..
Israel has moved into Lebanon, has its eyes on Syria. Hezbollah wants to transfer the hostages to IRAN. Will Israel use nukes? They are VERY pissed that Haifa got hit..
Anyone get the feeling that the first soldier 'kidnapped' may actually be in a green room somewhere sipping on an Evian and getting a shoebox full of american dollars?
OK, that may be a bit ridiculous, but does anyone get the feeling that this fireball looks a lot like a giant robotic duck holding a sword?
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jwalker
Token Discordian   SSHOLEPosts: 945 Registered: 8/6/2005 Offline
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7/13/2006 at 23:27 |
Get the feeling that WWWIII might have begun?
Nope.
NK isn't going to nuke anyone - they know damn well they would never survive it. Maybe if they were cornered, but there would be no one left to fight, so same result. Israel and the rest of the middle-east have been at it for a long time - nothing new there.
WWIII will probably be a fallout between the US, Russia, and China. You can already see them (all) flexing their muscles.
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IMBOLCPunxsutawneyPhil
SENATOR BABYHEAD  Posts: 244 Registered: 3/17/2005 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 00:10 |
....
OK, that may be a bit ridiculous, but does anyone get the feeling that this fireball looks a lot like a giant robotic duck holding a sword?
nope. no duck, no robotics, no sword.
but if it's geopolitical instability you are after look at the position that the OPEC countries have put the US in where the standard monetary unit is now the EURO and not the DOLLAR.
Also look into the Asian's having bought the dollars up and having a hefty leverage on Amerikanna.
Check the oil and gas futures and see if the red chinee are actually going to go GREEN--if they don't then we will have a middle east resource conflict with our creditors and Russia will silently play the right cards. Europe might just poop it's pants like usual.
Oh and the arabs get fucked, I think they like it that way though--but all they can do is attack public transportation and some infrastructure that empowers the facistic elements of our neo-protestant society.
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Dumbskull
I'm assuming the position!  SSHOLEPosts: 1894 Registered: 4/22/2004 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 00:50 |
Latest news: 9:02EST Israeli planes bomb southern suburb of Beirut, Lebanon.
HOLY FUCKERS!
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jwalker
Token Discordian SSHOLEPosts: 945 Registered: 8/6/2005 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 03:15 |
Wait, I've got it, check this out - it's because of the oil, but only indirectly. The big $ already knows the oil will run out and they're jockeying for position in the alternative energy race. BUT - it's BECAUSE the alternatives are free (solar, wind, etc) that they'll HAVE TO fight for it, just to stay in business!!
Keep your eye on the WTO; they'll be running it from behind the scenes...
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Lefen
I think Clavis wins my heart <3  SSHOLEPosts: 896 Registered: 9/16/2003 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 07:16 |
For some reason I can never seem to follow middle-eastern politics, so here's a useful article from the BBC's website that explains why Israel should be interested in bombing Lebanon (short version = conflict over land with the militant wing of Lebanon's major Shia Muslim political party, Hezbollah).
Who are Hezbollah?
and then here's a nice little article on the role of Syria
Beirut waits as Syrian masters send Hezbollah allies into battle (read the comments too)
edit for typos. there's probably more.
On 2006-07-14 at 02:33:17, Lefen praised Jejus
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Xihilisk
Tender vittles  Posts: 44 Registered: 3/16/2006 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 09:26 |
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Steel
If you want to keep your tongue, don't lick me in the Winter!  SSHOLEPosts: 486 Registered: 10/14/2004 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 16:22 |
Is that the cover for you new album? Kind of a combination of hardcore Israelli folk tunes, mixed with a little North Korean post-funk Jap Groove-tastica?
On 2006-07-14 at 11:22:57, Steel praised Jejus |
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Steel
If you want to keep your tongue, don't lick me in the Winter! SSHOLEPosts: 486 Registered: 10/14/2004 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 17:52 |
In all seriousness
CNN: Before Friday's bombing of Beirut airport, the United States helped broker an unusual deal that allowed a runway at the Beirut airport to be repaired long enough to allow a private aircraft carrying former Lebanese Prime Minister Najib Nakati and five planes from Middle East Airlines to take off.
No doubt carrying the Bin Laden family to safety again, or the like!
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Xihilisk
Tender vittles Posts: 44 Registered: 3/16/2006 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 18:12 |
The BBC news said the 5 planes took off to literally "save the planes"....Its fair enough, theyre not cheap. Then as soon as they had taken off, Isreal re-bombed the runways again. |
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freakbass
SENATOR BABYHEAD Posts: 128 Registered: 2/12/2006 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 19:18 |
Poor little baby Israel...
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Steel
If you want to keep your tongue, don't lick me in the Winter! SSHOLEPosts: 486 Registered: 10/14/2004 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 19:38 |
Heh Heh Heh
On 2006-07-14 at 14:39:46, Steel praised Jejus |
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jwalker
Token Discordian SSHOLEPosts: 945 Registered: 8/6/2005 Offline
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7/14/2006 at 22:24  |
A guy I work with just got back from visiting his family in Lebanon. He found this today on the CNN web site - it's a picture of his home village; his parents' house is just over the hill.
On 2006-07-14 at 17:25:26, jwalker praised Jejus
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DonQuixote
DARTH MENSES  Posts: 641 Registered: 4/22/2005 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 02:48 |
The Israel v Lebanon conflict is more likely to escalate than the N. Korea nuke issue.
Israel never gave Lebanon the ultimatum to get back their hostages from the Hezbola or else...place threat here.
It is for this reason that I think that the world sees this conflict as, not a war on terror, but a war that Israel has brought to Lebanon. All 9/11 references or war in Iraq like tactics are now null in void without the War On Terror label.
Its a good ol' fashioned state vs state war, which means countires can take sides and we can all repeat the Franz Ferdinand effect, only with way kewler guns.
Riddle me this though, why does the US government keep suppoting Israel? To the point that we vetoed a UN act that would sanction Israel for using too much force in this issue, as well as backing the blockade of Lebanon. Does the Bush Administration not recognize that Israel is a liability? I guess I answered my own question. However, does anyone think mutually assured destruction is even viable these days? Everyone thinks they're going to heaven to kiss Jebus on the toe and or lick Muhhamad's ass, they don't care if they are destroyed.
Oh well, when the nukes start flyin' I'm gonna find that hot chick in the office and fuck the shit out of her, cause my girlfriend works too far away and I'm sure she'd understand. I won't even care if the office bicycle reaches orgasm, as long as I gets mine.
Oddly enough all this WWIII talk makes me want to play RISK.
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Phlebas
SENATOR BABYHEAD  Posts: 207 Registered: 7/29/2005 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 04:29 |
DonQuixote:
Riddle me this though, why does the US government keep suppoting Israel? To the point that we vetoed a UN act that would sanction Israel for using too much force in this issue, as well as backing the blockade of Lebanon. Does the Bush Administration not recognize that Israel is a liability? I guess I answered my own question.
I would say that the most trained and incrededibly tactical (not to mention the most anti-muslim) force in the region would fall more in the lines of resource than a liability.
On 2006-07-14 at 23:47:17, Phlebas praised Jejus
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freakbass
SENATOR BABYHEAD Posts: 128 Registered: 2/12/2006 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 06:46 |
It seems that Hamas and Hezbollah are uniting which is all sorts of fucked up.
This is my understanding of the breakdown:
Hezbollah is Shi'a and funded by Iran to a tune of 100 million a year, probably much more from other sources.
Hamas is Sunni and funded by Syria and who knows who else.
They both hope for the destruction of Israel.
They have both taken Israeli hostages which is a HUGE deal because of what it means historically regarding Israel and their hostages.
Israel takes hostage_related_matters very person and considers the return of their hostages a priority above all else.
They will do whatever necessary to achieve this..
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freakbass
SENATOR BABYHEAD Posts: 128 Registered: 2/12/2006 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 06:57 |
"personally" is how Israel takes hostage matters..
also, Lebanon is a mess because the government cannot legally disarm the Hezbollah militia. They have the force to go down south and fuck them up but they do not have the authority politically and I think constitutionally (?)
It's as if those militia guys down in Texas starting attacking Mexico instead of just building fences and the US Army was not allowed to do anything about it.
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Lefen
I think Clavis wins my heart <3 SSHOLEPosts: 896 Registered: 9/16/2003 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 07:18 |
freakbass:
They have both taken Israeli hostages which is a HUGE deal because of what it means historically regarding Israel and their hostages.
I really think we need to get away from the incorrect idea that Israel are the "good guys" and the Palesitinans/Hezbollah are the "bad guys". It's just not as simple as that. Which is why I swarmed this.
From the article:
Israel has eliminated, through targeted assassination, hundreds of Palestinians and jailed thousands more, including women and children, and hit and jailed many Hezbollah activists. In the process, it has killed hundreds of innocent Palestinians and many Lebanese.
Israel has justified all this in terms of self-defence, and collateral damage in what it has called a fight against terrorism, as defined by itself.
It has never paid the least attention to the fact that Palestinian violent actions against Israel have had their roots in Israel's colonial occupation of the Palestinian land and brutal suppression of the Palestinians as a people, who, like Israelis, have the right to live in independence, peace and security.
Similarly, Israel has ignored the reality that its occupation of southern Lebanon for 20 years - until withdrawing unilaterally in 2000 because it could no longer sustain the cost of this operation - contributed substantially to making Hezbollah the fighting force that it is today.
The situation in the Middle-East is much more complicated than labelling one side as a bunch of terrorists and the other as a persecuted and peace-loving minority.
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freakbass
SENATOR BABYHEAD Posts: 128 Registered: 2/12/2006 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 08:13 |
That's great information there.
But please don't misinterpret my words as being pro-Israel or thinking they are dong anything positive here.
Just stating a fact that they traditionally have totally freaked out in situations where their citizens and/or soldiers have been taken hostage and subsequently responded with extreme harshness.
I frankly don't really support the 1948 occupation..
But I can understand their frustration after giving back land in an attempt for peace and having no one give a shit about it, continue to attack them and wish for their destruction..
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acheron
Cynical_Malcontent  SSHOLEPosts: 554 Registered: 4/29/2004 Offline
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7/15/2006 at 16:29 |
Whatever the complex background of the situation, the fact that the US is alone in its support of Israeli military tactics is more obvious now than ever. No one else is really backing them on this, not even Britain. So when you hear commentators referring to Israel's right to defend itself, just remember we're essentially alone in insisting that bombing Islamists and their civilian neighbors is going to somehow create stability. This is the shit that makes Iranian hardliners think Washington is controlled by zionists.
Will Israel use nukes?
No because thats guaranteed moral suicide. If Israel launches a first strike nuclear launch on any Arab target-we're talking about real widespread regional war on ethnic and religious lines.
On 2006-07-15 at 11:33:40, acheron praised Jejus
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Uart
DARTH MENSES  Posts: 1228 Registered: 3/5/2005 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 07:43 |
If there's a WWIII, I completely and entirely plan on using the chaos to step into one power-vacuume or another and take over the world.
Be afraid. |
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DonQuixote
DARTH MENSES Posts: 641 Registered: 4/22/2005 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 11:33 |
Uart: .. ..-. - .... . .-. . ' ... .- .-- .-- .. .. .. --..-- .. -.-. --- -- .--. .-.. . - . .-.. -.-- .- -. -.. . -. - .. .-. . .-.. -.-- .--. .-.. .- -. --- -. ..- ... .. -. --. - .... . -.-. .... .- --- ... - --- ... - . .--. .. -. - --- --- -. . .--. --- .-- . .-. - ...- .- -.-. ..- ..- -- . --- .-. .- -. --- - .... . .-. .- -. -.. - .- -.- . --- ...- . .-. - .... . .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. .-.-.-
-... . .- ..-. .-. .- .. -.. .-.-.-
fuckin hotlink natzis
On 2006-07-16 at 15:41:53, DonQuixote praised Jejus
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Clavis_Apocalypticae
Beautiful Puppet of Chaos  SSHOLEPosts: 747 Registered: 5/16/2004 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 14:35 |
DonQuixote: Uart: .. ..-. - .... . .-. . ' ... .- .-- .-- .. .. .. --..-- .. -.-. --- -- .--. .-.. . - . .-.. -.-- .- -. -.. . -. - .. .-. . .-.. -.-- .--. .-.. .- -. --- -. ..- ... .. -. --. - .... . -.-. .... .- --- ... - --- ... - . .--. .. -. - --- --- -. . .--. --- .-- . .-. - ...- .- -.-. ..- ..- -- . --- .-. .- -. --- - .... . .-. .- -. -.. - .- -.- . --- ...- . .-. - .... . .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. .-.-.-
-... . .- ..-. .-. .- .. -.. .-.-.-
You sad internet fagit.
...
I again stand by my belief that most of the ills of the world could be alieviated by erradicating or containing Muslims. Most every hotspot on the globe has been precipitated by Arabites. The Middle-East, Africa, Southeast Asia, Southwest Asia, Chechnya, the growing discontent with brown people in Europe(last summer's riots in France, the Denmark debacle, etc)...the list goes on. Yet people persist in holding the line of political correctness and start chiming in with the "Jews/Whites are evil. Muslims just want peace and harmony" fairytales.
I can only wonder what sort of unmitigated horrors have to take place before people wake the fuk up.
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acheron
Cynical_Malcontent SSHOLEPosts: 554 Registered: 4/29/2004 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 15:31 |
I again stand by my belief that most of the ills of the world could be alieviated by erradicating or containing Muslims. Most every hotspot on the globe has been precipitated by Arabites. The Middle-East, Africa, Southeast Asia, Southwest Asia, Chechnya, the growing discontent with brown people in Europe(last summer's riots in France, the Denmark debacle, etc)...the list goes on. Yet people persist in holding the line of political correctness and start chiming in with the "Jews/Whites are evil. Muslims just want peace and harmony" fairytales.
Well, we did bomb the Muslims in Iraq and killed thousands of civilians. So that ill of the world wasn't any muslims fault. Israel is holding the whole Gaza strip on the verge of starvation, so thats an ill of the world thats not muslims. Africa's problems are certainly not the result of Muslims.
As you well know, muslims often tend to live in politically troubled parts of the world. And obviously just because a person of a certain religious persuasion lives in a part of the world where there is conflict of some sort, that doesn't mean we kill them. That would not make a lot of sense. If you were to overlay a map of oil-rich and or crucially important geo-political regions of the world with Islamic countries, you'd find a lot of crossover. But people should already know that. And yes, killing or "containing" 1.4 billion people would be an "unmitigated horror" though I suspect you are just trying to offend people.
On 2006-07-16 at 10:49:48, acheron praised Jejus
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Clavis_Apocalypticae
Beautiful Puppet of Chaos SSHOLEPosts: 747 Registered: 5/16/2004 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 16:47 |
acheron: Well, we did bomb the Muslims in Iraq and killed thousands of civilians. So that ill of the world wasn't any muslims fault.
Their history of savage violence predates our fuking around where we don't belong.
acheron: Israel is holding the whole Gaza strip on the verge of starvation, so thats an ill of the world thats not muslims.
Which is exactly the same situation the Jews/Hebrews/Cana'anites were in before England, France, and eventually the U.S. started mucking around in their affairs. I'd have the same laissez faire attitude if our Native Americans started bucking to get back what was once theirs.
acheron: Africa's problems are certainly not the result of Muslims. Somalia, Sudan, The Congo, Morocco, Algiers, Libya, Tunisia, Egypt, Ethiopia...
acheron: As you well know, muslims often tend to live in politically troubled parts of the world. And obviously just because a person of a certain religious persuasion lives in a part of the world where there is conflict of some sort, that doesn't mean we kill them. That would not make a lot of sense.
I'd say a case could be made that they tend to GRAVITATE to many of them.
acheron: If you were to overlay a map of oil-rich and or crucially important geo-political regions of the world with Islamic countries, you'd find a lot of crossover. But people should already know that.
I agree.
acheron: And yes, killing or "containing" 1.4 billion people would be an "unmitigated horror" though I suspect you are just trying to offend people.
I'm not trying to be offensive just for the sake of being offensive. While I realize that containing 1.4 billion people is well nigh impossible, I also recognize that something has to be done. What that something is, I don't know. I'm up for suggestions.
acheron: For the timeline of this whole conflict, and I'm still reading up on it, it looks like Israel kidnapped two people out of Lebanon-which is a major crime and the kidnapping of the soldier was the reprisal. Thats what started the current situation. Once you read up on the current one, go back to about 600AD until present day. It's a fascinating tale.
acheron: and Check out the chomsky link I just swarmed for more info.
I'll check it out.
On 2006-07-16 at 11:48:10, Clavis_Apocalypticae praised Jejus
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Stump
SENATOR BABYHEAD  Posts: 310 Registered: 6/18/2002 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 17:02 |
Lefen:
I really think we need to get away from the incorrect idea that Israel are the "good guys" and the Palesitinans/Hezbollah are the "bad guys". It's just not as simple as that. Which is why I swarmed this.
Israel has justified all this in terms of self-defence, and collateral damage in what it has called a fight against terrorism, as defined by itself.
It has never paid the least attention to the fact that Palestinian violent actions against Israel have had their roots in Israel's colonial occupation of the Palestinian land and brutal suppression of the Palestinians as a people, who, like Israelis, have the right to live in independence, peace and security.
Similarly, Israel has ignored the reality that its occupation of southern Lebanon for 20 years - until withdrawing unilaterally in 2000 because it could no longer sustain the cost of this operation - contributed substantially to making Hezbollah the fighting force that it is today.
The situation in the Middle-East is much more complicated than labelling one side as a bunch of terrorists and the other as a persecuted and peace-loving minority.
Kind of a biased source there in that op-ed. Israel was first instituted and formed by the UN, the very organization that is now condeming them. The occupation of land that Israel has consistently tried to return has always been as a result of winning in wars of aggression started by it's Arab neighbors. There has never been a self-goverened state of Palestine in historical terms so the claims of oppression of 'Palestinain' peoples are patently false to begin with.
As for Israel labeling the PLO and Hamas as terrorist organizations look at the first charter for the PLO. One of their stated goals is the destruction of the state of Isreal. Isreal has offered land and concessions to the Palestinian 'government' and PLO and has been rebuffed numerous times. Israel has attempted in the past to return Sinai and the West Bank in parts to Egypt, Jordan, and Syria - all stable or semi-stable governments at the time and none of them want those regions back due to the terrorist/militant thugs inhabiting them. Why take a people like that into your own country to cause problems when you can just leave it for the Israelis to take care of and lose face points on the geo-political scene?
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DonQuixote
DARTH MENSES Posts: 641 Registered: 4/22/2005 Offline
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7/16/2006 at 21:39 |
Stump: Lefen:
I really think we need to get away from the incorrect idea that Israel are the "good guys" and the Palesitinans/Hezbollah are the "bad guys". It's just not as simple as that. Which is why I swarmed this.
Israel has justified all this in terms of self-defence, and collateral damage in what it has called a fight against terrorism, as defined by itself.
It has never paid the least attention to the fact that Palestinian violent actions against Israel have had their roots in Israel's colonial occupation of the Palestinian land and brutal suppression of the Palestinians as a people, who, like Israelis, have the right to live in independence, peace and security.
Similarly, Israel has ignored the reality that its occupation of southern Lebanon for 20 years - until withdrawing unilaterally in 2000 because it could no longer sustain the cost of this operation - contributed substantially to making Hezbollah the fighting force that it is today.
The situation in the Middle-East is much more complicated than labelling one side as a bunch of terrorists and the other as a persecuted and peace-loving minority.
Kind of a biased source there in that op-ed. Israel was first instituted and formed by the UN, the very organization that is now condeming them. The occupation of land that Israel has consistently tried to return has always been as a result of winning in wars of aggression started by it's Arab neighbors. There has never been a self-goverened state of Palestine in historical terms so the claims of oppression of 'Palestinain' peoples are patently false to begin with.
As for Israel labeling the PLO and Hamas as terrorist organizations look at the first charter for the PLO. One of their stated goals is the destruction of the state of Isreal. Isreal has offered land and concessions to the Palestinian 'government' and PLO and has been rebuffed numerous times. Israel has attempted in the past to return Sinai and the West Bank in parts to Egypt, Jordan, and Syria - all stable or semi-stable governments at the time and none of them want those regions back due to the terrorist/militant thugs inhabiting them. Why take a people like that into your own country to cause problems when you can just leave it for the Israelis to take care of and lose face points on the geo-political scene?
To start, any source on the conflicts in Israel WILL BE BIASED. The arguments of Clavis, Lefen and Stump lead into one of my strongest beliefs about the "Israel Problem" and two possible solutions to this problem.
The "problem" of the creation of the state Israel goes back much much further than the post WWII UN decision to give the Jewish people a state. "Israel" is a "Holy Land" to three major world religions: Judaism, Christianity and Islam. This little piece of land has been fought over for literally thousands of years as a result of these three religious claims to the land and because of the fertility of that land and its prime placement in the Mediterranean.
Stump, the Ottoman Empire was a Muslim empire and it did rule over the area that is now known as Israel.
Lefen, I have been to Israel and the Muslim population there is far from "brutalized". There are areas that are primarily Muslim and areas that are Jewish. Yes, the stateless "Palestinians" are marginalized, but they have chosen to protest in a violent manner instead of following the path of Gandhi and passive aggression. I understand their anger, but I disagree with their methods.
Clavis, you have no idea what most Muslims are like. Have you ever visited a Muslim theocracy? If so then I am very surprised that you would even hint at such a horrible idea. Your beliefs about Muslims are poorly formed at best. One could just as easily replace "crazy ass Christians that hate Jews and Muslims" with your comment about "jew/christian hating Muslims". Fundamentalists (read, extremists) are a problem for every major religion even Jews. I lived in Saudi Arabia for ten years and have seen great acts of kindness in that theocracy as well as great acts of, for lack of a better word, "evil". However, I have visited other Muslim states such as Turkey, where minarets and steeples rise side by side, with no problems at all. Also, if you have ever studied anything about the Koran, you'd know that all people of the Jewish faith that existed before Muhammad’s "revelation" are considered to be MUSLIMS. Also note that the Koran states that Jesus (usually mentioned as "the son of Mary") was a great prophet. The Koran is a book much like the Bible or the Tanak, which can be interpreted in various ways. Getting rid of Muslims is not the answer. You would just promote Christians to the rank of "craziest fundamentalists around". Remember the Oklahoma bombing was perpetrated by a WHITE AMERICAN CHRISTIAN. I believe that the real problem as far as religion goes are the fundamentalists not the average people of faith.
Lefen, I do agree that the current Israeli conflict is not as simple as Jews vs. Terrorists. It all goes back to the LAND that is now called "Israel".
For lack of a better solution to the "Israel Problem", I suggest that the UN create a neutral state in Israel's place. Of course the UN would actually have to have power or usefulness at any level, to do this for it to work. If the Holy Land for three different religions is occupied by any one of the three religions there will always be conflict.
The only other solution I can think of is to just completely obliterate all that is considered holy in that area, a well placed nuclear missile would do well, the fallout alone would keep the land inhabitable for at least hundreds of years. This act would have to be done by someone, or country, that is willing to be destroyed itself, and cannot be seen as one religion against another. North Korea might be a good candidate for this. They are not viewed as a religious state and they are demonized in almost every country around the world. China and Russia would quickly dissosociate themselves from North Korea if they perpetrated this act without any reason or provocation. This way there is no more holy land. No one could occupy it and the conflicts over that little piece of land would cease.
However, this is really just a corollary of the post WWII idea (mostly brought about in the areas that had been completely destroyed) that the most beautiful solution to the "human problem" would be a complete nuclear destruction of the entire planet.
I have yet to hear any better or more viable proposition.
On 2006-07-17 at 02:20:31, DonQuixote praised Jejus
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Stump
SENATOR BABYHEAD Posts: 310 Registered: 6/18/2002 Offline
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7/17/2006 at 03:43 |
DonQuixote:The "problem" of the creation of the state Israel goes back much much further than the post WWII UN decision to give the Jewish people a state. "Israel" is a "Holy Land" to three major world religions: Judaism, Christianity and Islam. This little piece of land has been fought over for literally thousands of years as a result of these three religious claims to the land and because of the fertility of that land and its prime placement in the Mediterranean.
Stump, the Ottoman Empire was a Muslim empire and it did rule over the area that is now known as Israel.
Lefen, I have been to Israel and the Muslim population there is far from "brutalized". There are areas that are primarily Muslim and areas that are Jewish. Yes, the stateless "Palestinians" are marginalized, but they have chosen to protest in a violent manner instead of following the path of Gandhi and passive aggression. I understand their anger, but I disagree with their methods.
Yes sir, Ottoman Empire was Muslim, however once again, there was never a self-governed state of Palestine historically. The region as a whole was refered to as Philstina or Palestine if you wish to call it that by the Roman Empire much as the peninsula of Egypt is refered to as the Sinai. It was made up of many self governed areas including Judea - the kingdom of Jews. Amazingly all the religions managed to live mostly peacefully here until the fall of the Roman Empire, and some of them still do as you pointed out. It says a lot about a people when the extremists are able to keep their Muslim neighboring countries from accepting them into their lands.
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DonQuixote
DARTH MENSES Posts: 641 Registered: 4/22/2005 Offline
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7/17/2006 at 03:51 |
edited for brevity's sake.
Yes sir, Ottoman Empire was Muslim, however once again, there was never a self-governed state of Palestine historically.
Point taken.
Back to Clavis' argument, how does one solve the problem of religious tensions without obliterating one or all of them?
I got nothin.
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( . )( . ) <--- Boobs. |
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Uart
DARTH MENSES Posts: 1228 Registered: 3/5/2005 Offline
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7/17/2006 at 04:05 |
DonQuixote:Back to Clavis' argument, how does one solve the problem of religious tensions without obliterating one or all of them?
Obliterate the extremists on both ends, leaving a moderate middle, filled with the creamy nougat of peace. |
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